Harry Barton Discusses Lean Management

View Segments Segment :

  • Citations
  • Add to My List
  • Embed
  • Link
  • Help
  • Citations
  • Add to My List
  • Embed
  • Link
  • Help
Successfully saved clip
Find all your clips in My Lists
Failed to save clip
  • Transcript
  • Transcript

    Auto-Scroll: ONOFF 
    • 00:17

      Well, I have a probably different backgroundto the majority of academics.Half my career I spent in the police serviceas an operational police officer for 10 years.Working in the east end of London, in the main.When I became a sergeant, I spent four yearsas a custody sergeant.And therefore, working in [INAUDIBLE] and Hackney.

    • 00:39

      It was a very busy division.And how effectively you could process customers-- prisoners,whichever way you want to define them-- was very important.And I soon realized that there were processeswithin the police station that couldbe more effective than they were actually

    • 01:03

      being utilized at that particular moment in time.Unbeknown to myself, I didn't realizewhat I was observing was going to be the future directionof my academic research.I moved on from the police serviceto the audit commission, which actuallywas a performance-driven, quality organization.Which was importantly looking at effectiveness and value

    • 01:27

      for money within public sector organizations.I did a few years within the audit commission,and then I moved into academic life.Into academia.In Cardiff, this is going, in the university there.And my first research project wasevaluating the academic performance of sea ports

    • 01:49

      around the world.And I very quickly recognized that the effectivenessand efficiency of a port was very muchdue to these logistical capabilities and competencies.But the management of all its operations,from human resource management perspectivebut a technical, professional perspective.

    • 02:11

      And therefore from those days, probably 15 years ago,I've always had an interest in manufacturingin terms of how organizations perform and are successfulwithin their particular product regions and product domains.Increasingly I recognize that a lot of the skills that

    • 02:33

      are innate in the management of manufacturing organizationsare transferable, to an extent, into service type operations.Over the last five years, I've beenlooking at the police service and higher educationas type areas where possibly some of the tools

    • 02:55

      and techniques of lead management--which work so effectively within manufacturing organizations--might be applied to servitization.And how we can transfer those capabilitiesinto the management of organizationssuch as universities and the police service.

    • 03:16

      So, five years ago I conducted a review of five police forceareas in the United Kingdom.And quite clearly, the police serviceis one of those great bastions of British society.The people know about what they don't know about.

    • 03:37

      They don't understand it.Police officers turn up at your door in an emergency,and they deal with it, and go away, and all the rest of it.If you look at it from a practical perspective,from a governmental perspective, it's a 13 billionpound organization which employees 135,000police officers, 70,000 administrative staff,

    • 04:01

      and thousands of pounds of police community supportofficers.So it's a huge organization itself.Politically, it's incredibly importantto any political parties.And therefore looking at the organization,to make it as effective in reducing wastewithin the organization, is a very important aspect,

    • 04:22

      from my perspective.What I've realized over the yearsis that the waste in the police servicecan be reduced very effectively, very, very quickly.But the problem is that the lean application from manufacturing,and using the tools and techniques whichare appropriate for reducing waste in manufacturing

    • 04:43

      organizations-- such as using a value stream-driven modelor reducing time to process prisoners, for instance--is all well and good.Seeking how some low- hanging fruit,you can get good results very, very quickly.And the people who are being monitored effectively

    • 05:05

      can say, well, lean has worked for us.So they tick the box and then they move on to another thing.What has been lost within service organizations,such as the police and higher education to a large extent,is that it needs to be a continual process.And this is the notion of continuous improvement.And the embeddedness of a cultureof continuous improvement, which has

    • 05:28

      to be led by the senior managers within those organizations.Now everybody can go on a course,can understand what lean is.They can apply a few tools and techniques.The problem is that it's not the applicationof tools and techniques.It's understanding the nature of the business that you're in.

    • 05:48

      Lean is all about providing valueto the service and users, the customers, if you like.So what does a customer want from a car?They want quality.They want reliability.They want it to be on time.They want it to look nice.They want it to be chic.They want it to be good value.All of those components, I think we can understand that.

    • 06:10

      The reason why JLR Land Rover has been so successfulis that he ticked all the boxes.He's delivering on of those measures.And that's why he's one of the big [INAUDIBLE]in the UK at this moment in time.That's why it's such a valued commodity.All of those are great attributesfor the service sector.

    • 06:32

      You, as a consumer of policing services for instance,want reliable policing services.If you're in trouble-- if you have an emergency--you want to be able and be dependent on somebodygoing to turn up at your door, being able to address youin a professional manner, being able to dealwith your situation, and allow you

    • 06:53

      to live in confidence and trust of the environment in which youexist.Those are more intangible than they are deliveringa car to your front door with an engine thatworks very well, that's nicely shiny, that it goes,you've got good HP agreements on it and all the rest of it.

    • 07:13

      So there's a subtle difference, I would argue,between transplanting lean manufacturing philosophiesinto service organizations such as the police and highereducation.And this is the area that I'm researching.And it's all about lean servitization.How can we utilize the knowledge and skills

    • 07:35

      which we've observed and learned--for instance, from the manufacturingsector of automotives-- into organizationssuch as the police and higher education.That can improve the level of trust and confidencein the consumer, in the customer,at the end of the day.We can do a lot internally to reduce waste.

    • 07:57

      We can become more effective and efficientin the utilization of resources.But the problem is at the moment,and this is the area that I'm researching,is that we can be very efficient,but how effective are we?So I can strip away lots of resources within the policeservice.We can reduce the number of ranks

    • 08:19

      within the police service.We can even reduce the number of police officers in the service.We can have increasing levels of privatization.However, the bottom line is, are the police any betterthan they were before we implemented leanwithin the police service?And that's the key area.

    • 08:41

      And the key interface.That I think that there is a level of education required.And a level of training within, certainly, the police service.Yes, be introduced to lean.Understand lean management.Understand the tools and techniqueswhich can actually move you to becoming moreefficient as an organization.But bear in mind, it's the effectiveness of the services

    • 09:04

      that you deliver will actually really demonstratethat you understand lean as a concept,from an organizational perspective.Well, I think that organizations are

    • 09:25

      run by colleagues, professionals whohave gone through a particular educational process.And performance management is somethingthat's on the undergraduate schedule and syllabusfor everybody, and at master's leveland MBAs across the world, and all the rest of it.And it's great.You can get your colleagues engaged with the process.

    • 09:48

      You have shared objectives.You review them on a three-monthly, six-monthly,or yearly basis.Hopefully you've achieved them, and everybody's happy.It means diddly-squat within organizationswhich are actually there to deliver servicesto the populace.

    • 10:09

      If I give you an example in the police service,in the 1980s performance managementwas the buzz word where all sergeants were inspected.All inspectors were expected to performancemanage their constables.Ultimately, police officers are law-abiding citizens.

    • 10:30

      They go to training college at Hendon.They learn the law.Then their expectation when they leave Hendonis to go out there and arrest criminals.Their actual interest in looking at objectivesabout what I'm going to achieve on a day-to-day basis--to have no disrespect for them, they'll pay lip service to it,

    • 10:50

      but they'll do as best they can to, as soon as they'reoutside the front door of the police station,do as they want.And, ultimately, the game isn't against police officersindividually.It's out on the street against the criminals.But also, on the other side of it, is protecting the public.Because of all the duties of police officers,

    • 11:12

      it's not just arresting criminals.It's actually preserving the peace,enabling tranquility, and all the rest of it.So it's a social area as much as everything else.I suppose the importance, what I'm interested inis how we can utilize the emotional construct of police

    • 11:35

      officers who are passionate about their work.But to recognize within themselvesthat they can improve the organization in which theyexist.Quite clearly over the last few years,we've identified, sadly, some serious miscarriagesof justice.Stephen Lawrence inquiry.We see time, and time, and again that there

    • 11:56

      are suggestions of corruption within the police service.There have been difficulties with allegationswithin Plebgate, you recognize that.And there are a lot of police officersout there who feel very omitted and very passionatelyfrustrated by the fact that they've

    • 12:16

      been let down by their leaders, their senior officers.That's not to say that they're not conscientious and willcarry on doing their duty as and when required.I think what's important in termsof how lean management can be applied positivelyto the police organization is that the notion

    • 12:39

      of continuous improvement in having value to the customeris crucial to the whole construct.And possibly where it needs to progressis very fundamentally at the probation and constablestage of training.You join the police service-- I've previouslymentioned about you take an oath and there

    • 13:01

      are primary objectives which haven't changed greatlysince 1829.You're there to protect the public.You're there to arrest criminals.You're there to prevent a breach of the peace.All of those things are very common sense,and you recognise what it's like.And people should be proud to be a police officer.It's a very, very difficult organizationto actually be recruited into.And hopefully they do a very good job at that.

    • 13:23

      But where we do move that, from 1829?Well, I would argue that what youneed to engage with police officers at that levelis to say, listen, this is what we want you to do as a society.But don't stop there.Think about how you, as an individual,can contribute on a daily basis, on a monthly basis,

    • 13:45

      to improving not only in the environment in which you exist,but the way that you're perceivedby your customers-- citizens-- on a day-to-day basis.And wouldn't you get that belief of continuous improvement,believe in the police as an organization.As looking at the ratings, if you wish,

    • 14:06

      in your local borough, in your constabulary.If you look at trust and confidence, for instance.There is a European social surveythat goes out every three years and looksat trust and confidence in the police service.And, sadly, the level of confidence and trustin the police service in the UK dips.

    • 14:28

      Quite rightly, I suppose.Through allegations and through quite obvious prosecutionsand all the rest of it.But what we need to have as police officers who understand,yes they're technically very good.Technically understand the law.Technically know how to arrest people.We're brilliant at public order.We have a great reputation.And probably still the best police service in the world.

    • 14:49

      There's no question about that.However, how do we go about one step more?And it's inspiring to believe-- and it's all about leadership.It's about people at the top seeing police officers,understanding that they need to engagewith their junior ranked officers.To reassure them that they are secure in their posts,

    • 15:13

      secure in their jobs.They're doing a good job.But we as an organization-- we as a policing organization--need to do something.We need to reinforce in the mindsof the public-- [INAUDIBLE] in the 1960s--that we are there for the citizen.We are not there for ourselves.

    • 15:33

      In truth, police officers, if you think about it,in a Utopian society wouldn't exist.So for the minority of the population-- it stillis a minority of the population-- who requirethe services of policing, those individualsare what we're there for.But we need to reassure the general populace

    • 15:56

      that we're not just doing the sakes of doing it to get paid.We're there to look at reducing crime continually.We're there to reducing our numbers.If you think about waste, which is the key in adding volume,I want to make myself out of a job.Now, it sounds very daft in a way.Why would I want to do to myself out of a job?

    • 16:18

      Well, you would.Because that suggests that societyis functioning in a behavior which is safe and secureand it reduces the necessity for our services.But our services are very broad.From a policing perspective, we can spend more timedoing other things which would probably

    • 16:40

      be far more interesting for the rankand file the potentially just walking around the streetsaimlessly.And I suppose, if I'm going to be not controversial but movingforward a little bit.I mentioned before, we have about 135,000 police officersin the UK.

    • 17:01

      The [INAUDIBLE] of police and crime commissionersis, in the main, to put constables backon the streets within their local communities.Which is a [INAUDIBLE] and it's a great suggestion.And it's going back to the '60s.However, I think we've got to recognizethat society-- the world, global, economic--is about cyber crime.

    • 17:22

      It's about serious criminals.It's about highly sophisticated individualswho need tracking down and arrested.And I would suggest at this moment in timethat we're far too focused on looking internallythan externally.And by that I mean is we can have a percentage

    • 17:43

      of our police officers who are doingthose things that we expect.But if we go back to my argument from before,they should be doing themselves out of a job, effectively.They should be operating within their local communities,reducing crime by their behavior,by their understanding, by their knowledge,and all the rest of it.But there needs to be far more resources applied to the higher

    • 18:06

      echelons of serious organized crimewhich go beyond the boundaries of the United Kingdomand all the rest of it.So I wouldn't have 135,000 police officersemployed in uniform.I would probably reduce that by a third,and put that third into-- we have a serious organized crimeagency at the moment.There should be an FBI.

    • 18:27

      I think there should be direct recruitment at a detectivelevel into the police service.Where individuals recognize that that is an elite organization.We can apply lean to that very effectivelybecause we know who the target criminals are.We know that there is an extreme level

    • 18:51

      of corruption at certain levels within financial services.We know that the counterterrorism,and all the rest of it.And all of those applications canbenefit from a lean approach but at a higher order, higherlevel.Because efficiency within those type of organizations,how you utilize very expensive resources--

    • 19:14

      we're talking about satellite whereyou can remote tracking mechanism and all the restof it-- that is the area where you can actually fundamentallyput feet or ears in post to actually dealwith the great threats to our society.So I don't want to sound too confused about this,but lean, as far as I'm concerned,

    • 19:35

      can work in two ways.At the community level, we want to reduce the level of servicebut to be visible.Which is the aspiration of most police and crime commissioners,to have police officers out there responsiveto the needs of local community.But I have a feeling that most people in those communities,if they feel safe and reassured, will

    • 19:57

      be very happy to support an elevated serious crimeorganization which actually tackles the threats thatare quite clearly apparent within our world at the moment.

    • 20:19

      The field is changing in terms of my particular areasof interest.Which, if I was to-- very clinical--would be the police and higher education.Both of which have existed, and therefore Ihave a level of knowledge.The police service, I think from a citizen's perspective,the majority of people don't really

    • 20:39

      want to be engaged with the police.There's something there, they're reassuring.But they don't want to be messing aboutwith them knocking on the door and havingto chat with them on a day-to-day basis [INAUDIBLE].It's nice to be reassured.I think that the police service itself, for many years,was a little aloof from itself and the citizens.

    • 21:03

      And was left alone because of its power.When we got back to the 80s really,the miners striking, to be honest,without the police I think we would potentiallyhave had anarchy.And we were very close at some stages to calling the Army in,which would have been a certain disaster.So I think the 80s saw and-- Margaret Thatcher

    • 21:27

      actually ushered in the value familiar regimewithin public services.And at that stage, I think that it was the first time reallythat business planning and the notion of looking at managementfrom a managerial perspective as opposed to looking at the bestcopper being the top copper.Because as we know, and in academia,the best professors don't necessarily

    • 21:48

      make the best deans or the best managerswithin the organization.Likewise, in the police, traditionally the best copperswho were necessarily promoted to the topweren't necessarily the best managers.Because there has to be a level of individualism and the waythat people do things and get things doneisn't necessarily contrary to the way

    • 22:08

      that people shouldn't be managed.So there whole managerial principleof the police service and higher education actually,over the last decade or so, has changed fundamentally.And it's a very interesting area to research and examine.I think from a practical point of view,if I look at the police, there are currently

    • 22:30

      42 constabularies including the city of-- 41including the city of London.I can't see, in 10 years time, that there'sgoing to be anymore than 10 constabularies.And as I've mentioned previously,I do see a cutting down of the numbers of police officersand the reorientation, reorganizationof the policing service to tackle serious organized crime.

    • 22:52

      Which is something I've debated about.But in terms of lean management and the waythat the future looks and the interest for my researchin particular is actually trying to assist them in a wayto look to the future and how we implement a future directionand strategy.Not only for the police service, but higher education.

    • 23:15

      So in the police service, if we look at itwith an open eye and a clean sheet of paper,who is it that we want running the organization?Who is it that we want being involved with the organization?And how can we do that in the most efficient way,but the most effective way.

    • 23:36

      And that requires broad understandingof discrimination.We need equal opportunities throughout the police service.We've done very well in gender.There are more female senior officerson the [INAUDIBLE] command course nowthan there are male officers.

    • 23:56

      The number of ethnic minority individuals,however, is disappointingly low.So there's a significant amount of effortthat needs to be done to understandin a multicultural society like the United Kingdom,why are we failing in that area?On such an important area, with such an important service.

    • 24:17

      So that's a big area that I'm looking at myself.But the application of lean in that perspectiveis very important.Because if I am wanting to provide the bestservice to my population, which is a multicultural population,then surely I need to engage with the population.Which is a multicultural population

    • 24:37

      and they should be representativewithin my service organization.And therefore it's a very topical, very controversialarea, but something that needs to tackled.But ultimately, we've got to be value-driven.And the value that we have as a societyis the value that you hold the police service.

    • 24:57

      The traditions of the police, I believe, are still there.I think they're a bit shaky in certain areas.But there needs to be a reassurance of confidenceand trust in the police service through its recruitment,through its demonstrating its effectiveness.With actually answering the questions

    • 25:17

      for the people on the street.Now, we've got a very interesting culture.We've got an aging community, so we've got a huge growthin people who're retiring.Who look back to the good ol' days still of the '50s, '60s,the Dixon of Dock Green.We've got a huge growth.

    • 25:39

      We've got a baby boom in the moment.And they look, possibly on YouTube,and see the police all around the world beating people upand being the adversary.Because this is the interesting thing about policing.Every country in the world has police.And the name police is police, polis, policia,

    • 25:60

      but everybody knows what they are and what they stand for.And, sadly, it's the bad side of the police which is alwaysvisually demonstrated.It's very easily visually demonstrated.So it's a huge battle that we face.And senior police officers face.And I'm interested in thinking about ways in which we

    • 26:21

      can train, actually, police officers to understandthe nature of their role.To understand how their actions canbe manifested into catastrophic consequencesshould they be out of control or leavea lapse and all the rest of it.In the old days-- I'm old enough to say the old days-- you

    • 26:44

      got a police station, happily one's downthe road speak to anybody you wantedto have no issues whatsoever.In these days, every officer with a badgewalks out of that front door and canbe held to account by multitudinous visualcommunications.By iPhones.

    • 27:05

      So their actions are continually monitored.But that's not to say that they shouldn't be reassuredthat they'll be supported.If they're acting in good faith, whateverthey want to do because people still have to be arrested.People still have to be stopped.And that's what they give the mandate to be doing.But they need to understand.And it's all about the purpose.We took the example of JLR.

    • 27:27

      When it was bought by Tata a few years ago,it had a highly skilled, highly effective workforcewho knew they were on the right direction.If you look at their results in terms of exports,80% of all their vehicles they produce is exported.And the reason for that is a committee workforce

    • 27:51

      who are passionate in the models that they're building.But they're building good stuff.Stuff that is reliable.It looks nice.It is chic.It's value-added commodities and all the rest of it.And every employee believes in the organization.And I think that what's happened in the police service

    • 28:13

      is that passion for being a police officer-- for whatindividuals joined-- isn't lost, but it's been eroded.And I think what is required, and it's certainlythe responsibility of junior ranks-- your sergeants,inspectors-- but as importantly the chief constable,

    • 28:34

      to lead police organizations with the flair and the passionto instill within their officers what a great and responsiblejob they have.The selection process to being a police officeris second to none.

    • 28:55

      I think that police officers-- or a certain percentageof police officers-- fail to remember and understandhow difficult it was to become what they aspired to be.But there needs to be more than that.There needs to be a continuous level of reflection

    • 29:16

      about the purpose of such officersand what they're doing within the organization.And I really passionately believethat it's been put off by politiciansfor a number of years now, but thereneeds to be a role of commissioner on the police.To really reestablish what it's there for.

    • 29:36

      Because I think that there are a significant number of policeofficers out there who are thinking,well, we're being beaten up all the time here.We're doing a good job, and yet we never get congratulated.We never get pats on the back.We're not there to be patted on the backbecause, initially, we're there to do what our job isand our service.But there needs to be a level of reflection.There needs to be the embodiments of a spirit.

    • 30:00

      A bit like JLR, that you are a brand.The Metropolitan Police, that we used for an example--which I served for very happily for over 14 years--is a brand, a global brand.Should be proud to be a Metropolitan Police officer.It's a damn hard job.But the reward's not that.

    • 30:22

      But the rewards are far more intrinsic than just money.It's actually what you can deliverto what would be one of the greatest capitalcities in the world.Without you, it couldn't function.And I think people lose-- our police officers lose--that belief that how important they are to the system.

    • 30:45

      The lonely police officer can have such a negative impactby being corrupt or being abusive or being outof place that will have such a disproportionate impacton the efficiency of the organization.But the effectiveness more importantly.The effectiveness of all of their colleagues.

    • 31:08

      And I think that if we can, not overdo it, but thinkabout lean and the way you manage people in termsof continuous improvement.And encouraging people to think about whattheir role within the organization is,and how they can continually improve it,is something that's really important for the future.

    • 31:32

      Well, my approach to teaching is very muchnot the traditional way.I am as I am.I am fortunate in that I've had experiences other than thatof higher duration.I think standing in front of 15, 100, or at least 500 students

    • 31:55

      is a privilege.And I look at is as a theatrical performance as much as anythingelse, where I need to engage the audience.Who are clients, they're citizens.They've taken the courtesy and time to go into that theater.And I would hope by the end of it they've learned something,but they've also enjoyed the experience.

    • 32:16

      So I do draw upon my experiences in terms of case studies.So if I'm introducing a subject such as lean management,I will almost invariably discuss the historyof lean and about how effective ithas been in generating a more efficient manufacturing

    • 32:39

      sector throughout the world.And how the principles, and tools, and techniquesare being utilized.But I'll knock it on the head because even the most ardentbusiness study student won't fall to lean within the servicesector.So very rarely would you anticipate that they wouldthink, well, higher education.

    • 32:60

      The organization in which you are enrolled, this university,is engaged in a lean process.And interestingly increasingly a numberof higher education institutions are taking lean very seriously.They have lean implementers.They have black belts and all the rest of it.So I try to put them in the position.

    • 33:23

      Identify well, I'm here as your professor.I want you to learn from this experience.But I want to add value to your learning experience.And it's as much about trying to embedwith them the understanding that they can improve their learning

    • 33:47

      capability and capacity.They can continually improve themselvesas much as being taught.Because it's about learning, it's not about teaching.It's about-- we have a fantastic library.Sadly, 80% of you won't spend a great deal in that library.You'll spend a great deal of time in the [INAUDIBLE] there.

    • 34:08

      [INAUDIBLE]So you have a bit of humor and all the rest of it.But, hopefully, what I'm trying to dois sow the seeds that you are in charge.I can give you tools and techniques, the same as in leanmanufacturing, but it's how you utilizethose tools and techniques, how you learn from the process.

    • 34:30

      But embedded within that, you understand the culture,the effectiveness of lean, which is about continually improving.And it's you as an individually whoneeds to continually improve.By learning, by observing, and by participating.And that's where you'll be a success.

Harry Barton Discusses Lean Management

View Segments Segment :


Professor Harry Barton discusses the topic of lean management. He describes how lean management ideas can be taken from the manufacturing industry and applied to service industries like policing. Professor Barton also explains his own research and how he teaches about lean management in the classroom.

SAGE Video Experts
Harry Barton Discusses Lean Management

Professor Harry Barton discusses the topic of lean management. He describes how lean management ideas can be taken from the manufacturing industry and applied to service industries like policing. Professor Barton also explains his own research and how he teaches about lean management in the classroom.

Copy and paste the following HTML into your website

Back to Top