[Introduction to addiction][MUSIC PLAYING]

TRACI POSTINGS: My client Lucy spent many, many years--as I've said-- in very chaotic and very complex drug use.And so this would certainly come into the umbrellaof substance misuse.However, I do not believe that Lucy's issue--

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: although I don't like that word--is about substance misuse.And again, if I try and contextualize that,there are different patterns of drug use.And three of the most common would be experimental drug use,where people might try something because their friends are

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: trying it.They might try something to rebel against something.And they might try something out of curiosity.And that may well be the end of their drug experience.There is another category, which is recreational drug

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: use, which I guess the majority of peoplewould put themself in.So this could be certainly alcohol,would come massively under the banner of recreational druguse.Cannabis is known as a recreational drug.Whether or not that's true remains to be seen.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And this is where, in my understanding,the drug use enhances life.It adds interest.It adds enjoyment and pleasure to a lifestyle.Then if we move on, there is dependent drug use,where someone relies on and needs a drug in order

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: to be able to function in life, regardless of consequences,to some extent.Now Lucy, out of the three, Lucy would almost definitelypresent with a dependent drug use problem.However, I don't think that fully captures the story.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: Lucy would describe herself as an addict.And although she was certainly dependent on substances,actually many people-- and I've worked with such peopleand I've known such people-- present with a dependencyon the substance.However, when that is worked through,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: they are often able to go on and live a life, whatever thatmight be, without any adverse consequencesfrom their drug case.However, as you listen to the session,you'll hear Lucy talk about other addictions,other dependencies-- on food, on relationships,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: on drugs-- which would suggest that thisis more than a dependency on drugs,and that this is somehow somethingto do with Lucy and her relationship with these things.And so this is my understanding of addiction,that the substances are simply a symptom of something that's

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: used outside of the self to try and make inside feel better.And I have some definitions of addiction.And the one I like is by Morse & Flavin.And it says, "Addiction is a primary, progressive chronic

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: disease with genetic, psycho-social and environmentalfactors influencing its development and manifestations.The disease is often progressive and fatal.It is characterized by impaired control over useof the substance, preoccupation with the substance,adverse consequences and distortions in thinking."

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And this, to me, captures what addiction is.And I actually, my personal belief is that it is a disease.And I would work from the basis of the disease model.And when we think of disease, we oftenthink of measles or some sort of infection or something.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: When actually if we break that word up, it's simply dis ease.The person is not easy and is not at ease,and so that certainly applies to addiction.Some other definitions are it's "a chronic relapsing disease

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: characterized by compulsive drug seekingand drug use, and by neurochemicaland molecular changes in the brain."And if we look at the origins of the word, it's a Roman word,and it actually means slave.And the galley slaves in the big Roman ships

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: were chained in the basement and forced to row,and they were called addicts.And it actually means surrender to a master.And again, something interesting to consider,is what I'm explaining suggests that someone

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: has no choice, if they're in the grip of an addiction.And yet there is a huge argument that says we all have choice.And I would argue that.But I would hope that the work, the work I do with Lucy,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: and the work and support that's available with an addiction,affords someone the choice.But I actually don't think that choiceis available in the middle of an addiction.A more personal definition, I guess,that I like of addiction, is it's never

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: being able to get enough of something that you don't want.And when you listen to the session with Lucy,I think that message comes across very clearly.And her life was really difficult and really painful,and yet she couldn't stop.So in the end, her addiction wasn't something

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: that's done for pleasure.It was done simply because she had no control over it.But possibility my favorite definitionis that addiction is simply a desperate lack of love.And whether or not that's external or internal,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: it really doesn't matter.But I think that definition encapsulatesexactly what addiction is.[Introduction to substance misuse][MUSIC PLAYING]

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: Hello.My name is Traci.I'm the counselor in the following sessionyou're about to see.And I'm working with someone called Lucy.Lucy's come to counseling after many yearsof polydrug use and a lifestyle that was incrediblychaotic and unmanageable.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: Alongside that, Lucy, as you will see,talks about how difficult and painful her childhood was.And how that played a part in how her life unfolded.Before we move on to the session,I think it's important for us to understand

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: what I mean by complex polydrug use,and how that might differ from other types of drug use.And often the term "drug misuse" is heardand "substance misuse."And if you think about what this means,it's quite interesting, really, in that

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: if we break the word down, it's an abnormal use of something.Or it's misusing something.I think it can become quite complicatedwhen we begin to think of what actuallyis misuse of something.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And, actually, a drug can take many forms.I've got a couple of definitions here, actually.A drug is "any chemical substance,synthetic or extracted from plant or animal tissue,and of known or unknown composition,which is used as a medicament to prevent or cure disease."

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And that's Butterworth's Medical Dictionary.And Collins Dictionary defines a drugas "a chemical substance which is usedfor the effect it produces."And when we just think of that simple sentence,a drug can actually be many things.And, first of all what springs to mind

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: are drugs like heroin, cocaine, cannabis.And these are the drugs we hear about whenwe think of substance misuse and drug misuse.But, actually, a chemical substancewhich is used for an effect couldbe many other substances, substances such as caffeine,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: such as nicotine, alcohol, sugar.All of these are substances that areused for an effect it produces.But can we really think of these as a drug?And along side of that, are these substancesthat can be misused?And I actually bring these into the equation,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: because, certainly in the States, the treatmentcenters and the rehabilitation centers,where people go to detox from a substanceand to try and find a recovery, often attend the white powdertreatment centers, because it's believedthat the most addictive substances are white sugar,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: white flour, and cocaine.And this might seem completely ridiculous to thinkof white sugar and white flour in terms of a drug,but when we think in this country of obesity and heartdisease, and the role that food plays,it actually begins to make a lot more sense.So actually, something as innocuous, and as innocent,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: and as socially acceptable as food can actually be misused.So could that be a substance misuse?And if we think of alcohol, at what point doesalcohol use become misused?Is it after one pint?Two?Three?

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: Is it after six pints?Or is it when someone drinks more than twice a week?Does that go from use to misuse?Or is it when someone drinks every day?Or is it when someone only drinks occasionally,but when they do, they become very violent and veryaggressive, or get themselves in all sorts of trouble?

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And when we start to look at this,we can see that actually the line between use and misuseis not as clearly defined as we might think.And when we think of other substances,there are so many issues around culture, around society,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: around economics, around politics, that make,again, the line between use and misusevery, very thin and wavy.So these are just things to think about.I'm not saying I have any of the answers to those,but something to think about.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: [Introduction to the counselling session][MUSIC PLAYING]In this session, I'm working with my client, called Lucy.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And this is our second session together.Lucy has come to counseling after many, many yearsof drug use.She's been through rehabilitationand is now living an independent life

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: and trying to live her life without the use of drugsand without the use of alcohol.Lucy talks about many difficult and incredibly painful issuesassociated with her childhood and her drug use.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And during the session, she talksabout things like being raped, being in prison,being physically abused, and she alsotalks about an enormous amount of neglect in her childhood.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And although these are incredibly important issues,the focus on the session, in some ways I didn't pick upon those issues because I felt it was important

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: that Lucy was able to lead the wayshe wanted the session to go.But also, although these things were incrediblytraumatic and difficult, it felt much more importantfor us to form an understanding and for usto form a relationship and a foundation

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: upon which to build our work.And in many ways, as I've said, I see addictionas a relational issue and that Lucy's relationshipsup until now have been with substances.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: They've been with drugs, they've been with alcohol.And the relationships with people,she's had have been incredibly, incredibly abusiveand dysfunctional.So in many ways, our meeting, it felt very important

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: that we form the platform, if you like, from which to work.As Lucy's life story unfolds, it becomes very clearthat it's been an incredibly traumatic life.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And she's been wounded and hurt many, many times over.And, in relation to our work, perhaps wecan use an analogy of a house.And that if we imagine that Lucy, herself, is the house,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: and she sustained nothing less than a bomb blast, actually,and that the actual foundations of herself,the foundations of the house wererocked by her upbringing and her lifestyle.And, you know, the roof has been blown apart,the windows have been blown out.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And it would be incredibly foolish, actually,to walk into a house like that, to see what's going on,because it's not safe.And so, in some ways, the relationshipI hope to form with Lucy would belike putting scaffolding up around the house,so the house is held.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And then we can begin to look at the parts of the house thatneed healing and the parts of herself thathave been incredibly damaged by the traumathat she's been through.And so, our work initially will be

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: about putting the scaffolding up around the house,and so making it safe for her to be able to explorethe fragmented and wounded parts of herself,and will allow us to work togetherto hopefully find ways of making the house livable in again.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: [Counselling session with Traci Postings, Addiction counsellor][MUSIC PLAYING]Let's move on to the session.And also, with a lot of gratitude

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: to Lucy for her honesty and courage.Hello again, Lucy.

LUCY: Hello.

TRACI POSTINGS: How are you today?

LUCY: Mm.I don't even know.

TRACI POSTINGS: Well I know after the first time last week,and we talked about a lot of stuff, and I think most of wewere talking about your drug use and how dark life became then.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And in a way, although life is much better nowthat you're not using any drugs, but it's difficult.And painful.

LUCY: Mm-hmm.

TRACI POSTINGS: And then we lookedat some of the things that have happened in your life.I'm talking about your mom's death and all the thingsthat you went through, during your active addiction.

LUCY: And you say, oh, it's better now.It is better, but I just imaginedthat I'd stop taking drugs and my life would be all right.And it ain't.It's just really, really hard.

TRACI POSTINGS: And I know you said last weekthat it's really, really hard.What does that mean?What's hard?Where's hard?

LUCY: All of it, really.I think life.How am I supposed to-- it's like I don't know what to do.Kind of like, what--I just get up,and I'll go through the day, but it just doesn't seem easy.It's just such a-- just stuck, I feel stuck a lot of time.

LUCY [continued]: It's like turmoil.

TRACI POSTINGS: Under turmoil.Something that you spoke about last week,it's something that seems to be with you a lot of the time.And you also said last week about not being able to settle,not being easy.

LUCY: It's like that all the time.It's just that it's like I've justgot to do things, all the time, just got to do, do, do, do, do.And I try and go out, I mean, just sit down,and I have to clean up.And then I can't even watch telly.And then I've got to speak to someone.It's just like when is it, when is it just going to stop?

LUCY [continued]: Do you know what I mean?That's how I feel, it's like when is itgoing to be all right?

TRACI POSTINGS: When is it going to be all right?Or when are you going to be all right?Which one are we talking about?

LUCY: I don't know, really.Will I ever be all right?I don't know.

TRACI POSTINGS: There was somethingabout that that seemed quite tricky, to hear,as I said when will it be all rightor when will you be all right?You really-- I don't know.How did that feel when I said that?Because you seemed to really like order.

LUCY: Yeah, that kind of threw me.I thought, is it it?Is it me?Is it?

TRACI POSTINGS: What is it?

LUCY: What is it?Yeah, what?

TRACI POSTINGS: What is it?

LUCY: I don't even know what it is.

TRACI POSTINGS: We keep saying "it" as if it's a thing.

LUCY: It just hurts.It fucking hurts.

TRACI POSTINGS: And it's something in you that hurts.

LUCY: Maybe.[SIGH] I just wish it was all different, really.

LUCY [continued]: You know, I sometimes think like, if my mom never died,would I have took drugs?Would I have ended up taking heroine?I don't know.Whenever my brothers introduced me to it,would I have ever took it?If my upbringing was different, would I be different?

LUCY [continued]: And I kind of rough it.But it just seems to be kind of no different.At different-- no, I'm not in prison,and I'm not committing crime.

LUCY [continued]: It's like I don't know what I was expecting,but, I just want to be all right.

TRACI POSTINGS: And actually, it sounds as if a part of youis still in prison, because you said,I'm not in prison, but this, this.When's it going to be all right?When's it going to-- when is it?What is it?And was it this and a searching and atrying to work it all out.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And understanding that, that life's much better,but actually, to be honest, it doesn't sound as if it'smuch better for a part of you.That the practicalities might be better, but part of youis still locked away in prison.

LUCY: But so I'm not-- how am I supposedto understand all that?It's like, is that what I don't know.Is that why I've come here?

LUCY [continued]: I just don't really understand it all, really.

TRACI POSTINGS: So why do you think you came here?

LUCY: To get some understanding of it.So I can get there, wherever I'm going.It's just endless.I just sometimes think, if my mom was still here,

LUCY [continued]: would that make me feel better?If I had a job, would it be better?If I had a boyfriend, would it be better?It's just like anything, grabbing onto anything, really,just to make me feel better, really.

TRACI POSTINGS: Just something outside that you can takeinside and find some peace.

LUCY: Yeah.I just feel it.I could just feel that.It's like a hole.

TRACI POSTINGS: And nothing's filling it.

LUCY: Even food.It's just I can eat and eat and eat and eat and eat and eat.And I just feel sick.And then like I think you fat bitch.

TRACI POSTINGS: So then there's this need to keep eating,to keep doing something, to get something.But then you really give yourself a hard time.It's just there's a need inside you.

LUCY: Yeah, it just doesn't fill up.

TRACI POSTINGS: It's a hole in your pocket, Lucy.

LUCY: There's a hole in my pocket.

TRACI POSTINGS: You mentioned your mom a couple of times.

LUCY: I don't know.I just think, would be really nice.Do you know what?I think I get jealous of other people,and they're growing up and going to be moms.And I'll go like, oh.And it really kind of-- so now that I'm grown up,

LUCY [continued]: I'd like to have a relationship with her,but, it's almost again, I'm never going have that.Do you know what I mean?It's just not going to happen.And even if she was still alive, she'd most probablytell me to go away anyway.

TRACI POSTINGS: So that's-- that seems at odds thatyou're desperate, to have this person,to have something to make it OK.And you want your mom.

LUCY: Mm-hmm.

TRACI POSTINGS: And yet, there's also the,and it didn't sound like a fear.It sounded more like a maybe, that she'd tell you to go away.

LUCY: Mm-hmm.But she was quite harsh.And I, I just wanted her to be nice to me, really.

TRACI POSTINGS: You wanted a mom.

LUCY: Yeah.

TRACI POSTINGS: You wanted one then, and you need one now.

LUCY: It's just that feeling of, am I going to be all right.You know?Maybe I just want someone to say it's going to be all right.

TRACI POSTINGS: Comfort.

LUCY: [SIGH].So what do I do?Do you know what I mean?What am I supposed to do if-- did

LUCY [continued]: you know that when I took gear, I didn't get this.I didn't get all this.And I just wasn't expecting that.I just keep getting overwhelmed and I justget really, really sad and--

TRACI POSTINGS: Sounds like there's just nothing that can,there's nothing that you can findthat can look after a little girl who wants her mom.And it's just too much for you to try and manage.But it sounds like the gear did it, in a way weird sort of way,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: that it was your mom, for a while.

LUCY: Yeah.It kind of helped me.It's something that we say that that allowed mefor a little while.

TRACI POSTINGS: Yeah.That allowed you to look at something else.

LUCY: Yeah.

TRACI POSTINGS: And maybe that's whatyou are looking for now, you're lookingfor someone to hold you.

LUCY: Yeah, that makes sense.It's quite scary, really, because, this

LUCY [continued]: is how it's kind of going to be, constantly just trying to makemyself feel all right, really.

TRACI POSTINGS: And also, it's blooming horriblebecause the fantasy was, and the promise was, you stop usingand it will be OK.And instead, everything that held you together, in a sense,it feels as if it's gone.And what's so horrible is what was holding you together

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: was killing you as well.

LUCY: I don't know where I've gone, I just don't.

TRACI POSTINGS: Said, I don't know where I've gone.

LUCY: How long have we got left?

TRACI POSTINGS: We've got a little while.Feels as if some part of you has had enough.

LUCY: Yeah.

TRACI POSTINGS: It's like, right, that's it.

LUCY: Yeah.

TRACI POSTINGS: I'll be off now.

LUCY: Yeah, so, yeah.

TRACI POSTINGS: So it's a different part of you now,is that right?Thank you.

LUCY: Yeah, I don't know.It's just, the sickness, it's almost like closed now.

TRACI POSTINGS: Mm.So, a little part could be seen, now that shifts.And I'm mindful that you said youcame here looking for answers, looking to sort it.And maybe it shifts against me who'snot giving you those answers.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: I'm not telling you what the solution is.

LUCY: But will you be able to do that, though?If I can't find it, where do I look?Again, I thought, well that just shows me, everywhere I go,

LUCY [continued]: expecting.I expected it from my mom.She never gave me anything.

TRACI POSTINGS: And I was just thinking exactly that, that youcome here with an expectation--

LUCY: Yeah.

TRACI POSTINGS: --and I just join a long lineof people that let you down.And I don't come up with the goods.

LUCY: So what do you do, then?Why am I-- what is supposed to happen?Because it just sounds it's just goingto be another waste of time, just like everything else is,really.

LUCY [continued]: Oh, fucking how this is just--

TRACI POSTINGS: Sounds like it's pissing you off.

LUCY: Yeah.

TRACI POSTINGS: And, yet when I saidit sounds like it's pissing you off,I think what I meant was maybe I'm pissing you off.But you said yeah.But, as you said yeah, it soundedlike you weren't pissed off anymore, if that makes sense.And you sort of, well, maybe it'sdifficult to be, don't know.Find out what things.

LUCY: Yeah, I thought, I don't know if-- I don't know, really.I don't know if I'm pissed off with you.I don't even know you enough to be pissed off with you, really.I'll just pissed off of it all, really.

LUCY [continued]: With myself, with life, with-- I just can't get out of that one.I wished it was different.I just wished it was different.

TRACI POSTINGS: How would you have it, Lucy?How would it be?

LUCY: I would have liked to have been special.That's what I would've liked.To have been shown some love and attention.I think more of attention.And I remember being at school, and, you know,

LUCY [continued]: like the moms used to come in, take their kids,drop their kids off.And I just have to go to school on my own.And, you know, just that sort of envy, like,oh, I wish my mom done that.You know, pack lunch and pack you money

LUCY [continued]: and be able to buy sweets in the morning and-- even my momsaying goodnight, really.So, do you know what?I just think this is, like, even though she died,

LUCY [continued]: it's almost I dream-- like, I wanted it to be like that,but actually it won't.So it's hard to get out.You know, people say to me, oh, were you close to your mom?And I go yeah, but I wasn't.

TRACI POSTINGS: But you wanted to be.

LUCY: Yeah.And that's, it's almost like, because I knowI'm never going to have it.I could make it up if I want it to happen.

TRACI POSTINGS: Yeah.

LUCY: And that is the reality, like I said.If I went to her now, she'd emotionallytake off right away.So I kind of know that, but can't get outof that fantasy just to pretend it's all OK,do you know what I mean?

TRACI POSTINGS: And that you are special to her,and you are loved.

LUCY: Yeah.

TRACI POSTINGS: And somebody comes to schooland makes you a packed lunch and says night-night, tucks you up.And loves you.And loves you in a way so that you feel loved.

LUCY: Yeah.Just felt lonely as a kid, just by myself generally.She was actually quite frightening.

TRACI POSTINGS: So you were lonely and scared.

LUCY: Yeah.I think that's how I feel a lot of the time, actually.And again, I'll kind of-- I still pretend it's all right.

LUCY [continued]: I know, you're fine.You're fine.

TRACI POSTINGS: It's all OK.

LUCY: Yeah.But I still got that feeling there.

TRACI POSTINGS: So you've traveled ahead of a journey,and you've arrived at the lonely and scared loveless place.

LUCY: Yeah, this is what's [INAUDIBLE] enough.It's happened.I've been to prison loads of times, and I'm tough.I'm a tough cookie.And that's what's almost thrown me, actually.We've got these recoveries-- this is what's--

TRACI POSTINGS: Not what you were expecting.

LUCY: No, I didn't know about-- you know what,that's quite weird, actually.Because I could've said I didn't knowwhat it was like to be lonely or scared.But I just said that as a child I was like that.

LUCY [continued]: But I didn't know I'd felt like that.So if this is what's supposed to happen, you give up the drugsand that comes.

TRACI POSTINGS: Well this is what has happened.And it's almost-- what I'm, what I'vebeen thinking the last few minutes isif you have ever heard the story of the little match girl?

LUCY: No.

TRACI POSTINGS: Have you heard that story?

LUCY: Vaguely.

TRACI POSTINGS: She's very poor and raggedy.And briefly she sells matches to try and get a few pennies.And the people that look after her don't look after her.They're very cruel and she's not treated well.And one winter it's so cold, that even though she's

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: going to get in trouble, she lights a match, justfor a little bit of warmth.Just for a little bit of warmth, just a little bit.But when she lights the match and the flame,she sees what she remembers as her grandmother's house.And in the flame, she sees her loving grandmotherand a table with food, and she sees a warm fire.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: Everything she's ever wanted.And then the match goes out.And she's too frightened then to light another one,but the next night, when she's in the snow and the cold,she lights a match.And she sees again everything she ever wanted in that flame.And it goes out, but this time shelights another, and another, and another,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: until they're all gone.And it just reminded me, as you'retalking about gear and drug use, for that time, you didn't feel.You didn't know about the fear, and the aloneness,and the terror, and misery, because the promise

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: was in the flame.But that's gone.The matches are all burnt out.

LUCY: And this is it, now then?

TRACI POSTINGS: However, I'm alsovery mindful of a few minutes ago, you said, but I'm tough.What's this?What's this?I'm tough.And you see, I believe the little girl, absolutely.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: But I also believe the tough part,or you wouldn't be sitting here.

LUCY: But I don't know if I can handle this part.This is--

TRACI POSTINGS: It's too heavy, too much.

LUCY: It's kind of like it's quite easy to be tough.I kind of like her.The toughness is wearing out, really.

TRACI POSTINGS: Yeah, yeah.And there's nowhere to hide.There's no drugs.There's no matches.There's no matches.

LUCY: Yeah.

TRACI POSTINGS: And the pain is so deep.And the wound is so raw at the minute.It's like oh my god, what am I going to do with this?

LUCY: Yeah.So what do I do then?

TRACI POSTINGS: Well what are we going to do about this?

LUCY: Well you tell me, because you're the therapist.

TRACI POSTINGS: What does she need?

LUCY: I don't know.I need a match.

TRACI POSTINGS: Mm-hmm.And the match always worked, the bitter gear always worked.But actually, every single time, without fail,it abandoned you just like everybody else did.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And I'm sitting wondering if the trick is to find one of them,you have a light and matches.

LUCY: Yeah, that would be good, wouldn't it?Yeah, just, like, will it ever-- you know,what you see in the match, I can see what you're saying.Will I ever get to that-- is life-- well, I

LUCY [continued]: can only say it's like, if I light,will that match become real?Do you know what I mean?Or is it just going to be wishing, wishing, wishing?

TRACI POSTINGS: And more fantasy, and more pretend,and more illusion.

LUCY: Because that's what [INAUDIBLE].Now, I'm going to, when I leave here in a minute,I'm going to just go like, oh, hello, yeah, I'm fine.

TRACI POSTINGS: Yeah, yeah, yeah,

LUCY: And pretend.

TRACI POSTINGS: Yeah.

LUCY: And just do whatever I can, to get through the day.

TRACI POSTINGS: I'm wondering, you know,that part, the survivor, you that goes about and says hello,are you all right?What are you doing?Yeah, and has a laugh, and you know, the tough bit.Did that part of you bring the other part here,to be able to be with just the awful emptiness.

LUCY: I don't know.I just came.

TRACI POSTINGS: Mm-hmm.Looking for answers.

LUCY: Yeah.

TRACI POSTINGS: That you're not getting.

LUCY: Yeah.All right, so, how many time have I got to see you?Another five times?

TRACI POSTINGS: And it's like we've gone back into your head,OK, I need a chart now.Do six of these and three of them, four of themand it will be all right.

LUCY: Yeah, will it be all right?

TRACI POSTINGS: And it feels very different in herethen when we were talking about the feelings,when we were talking about, when we're talking about the hurt.We had became quite businesslike.

LUCY: All right.Yeah, but still.I still--

TRACI POSTINGS: How much longer?

LUCY: Yeah.So can you not tell me nothing?Can you not?You ain't got the answers if I got the answers.

LUCY [continued]: It just seems all too hard again.

TRACI POSTINGS: Yeah.It feels really heavy at the minute, and, what do we do?And yet, what really, and I was goingto say what really strikes me-- whichis really interesting after talking about

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: matches-- as you said what you were looking,I'm looking for a match, actually,since we've been talking, although life is harder--practically it's much better.But you're in so much more discomfort and diseasesince you stopped taking drugs, I haven't heard you say,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: I want to go and use something.I want to go and use drugs.I heard you say you want your mom.But I haven't heard you say, I've had enough of this.I'm--

LUCY: I can't.I can't.I used for so long.I've tried to stop so many times.I'm sick of smoking crack, being raped, and sick of prison.

LUCY [continued]: And I've tried to stop loads of times, but what happened was,I got sick off the drugs.When I use to score, it used is to be in my hand,and there's like a famous walk, like you got the walkon [INAUDIBLE] smoke.

LUCY [continued]: And I lost it.So I just, I don't feel like smoking drugs.I just want to feel all right.

TRACI POSTINGS: Yeah.You've had enough of that.

LUCY: It didn't, it stopped working.It stopped doing what it said on the tin for me.

TRACI POSTINGS: Yeah.And so there's an ending there, and here we are,and OK, that don't work.But you're in a place-- that don'twork-- we're not there yet.And this middle place of, well, what will work?What do I have to do?

LUCY: OK.OK.

TRACI POSTINGS: Between a rock a hard place, really.It's really difficult.

LUCY: Yeah.But you know what?That's kind of making me feel gooda bit because I didn't think that Iwasn't [INAUDIBLE] and thinking of using.So I'm not thinking of using.So that's got to be a good thing, isn't it?

TRACI POSTINGS: You're looking for comfort.And you're looking for ease.And do I get a job?I want normal.You're looking for something.

LUCY: So have I got to get that, though?

TRACI POSTINGS: What did you say?You wanted to feel special.

LUCY: Yeah.

TRACI POSTINGS: You wanted to feel special.And you wanted to feel cared for.You wanted to have somebody make you a packed lunch.

LUCY: Yeah.Sounds quite silly.

TRACI POSTINGS: Silly?

LUCY: I want someone to make me packed lunch.

TRACI POSTINGS: Get to go to schoolall nice and clean and nice uniform, nice clothes,packed lunch in a little box, wrapped up nice.Instead of the picture I got of the little girlwhere you said, just went any old how,with nobody to say goodbye, nobody to make breakfast.

LUCY: Yeah, do you know what?This is what I get, because that ain't going to happen anymore.That's past.So this is where I get angry, because it's like Iwant all that, but it's gone.

LUCY [continued]: It's gone.Do you know what I mean?And then it's-- Because I suppose, all right,that's where I'll go with my mom, I want it.I wanted it.But then I'll get, well you never bloody gave it to me.

TRACI POSTINGS: And it's too late now.

LUCY: Well, it's too late now.What if?What if?What if?What if?

TRACI POSTINGS: If only.Maybe.

LUCY: And that's kind of what goes on.Do you know what I mean?What-- again, looking back at the girls at school,I wonder if they, I wonder how their life is.Do you know what I mean?If they became normal.You know what I mean.

TRACI POSTINGS: Or if they walked through hell like youhave.

LUCY: And it's really strange, whatyou're saying, because it's like,the lives, if I told someone about my life-- the crackhouses, being raped, being beaten up, fighting goingto prison.

LUCY [continued]: Saying it like that sounds quite awful.

TRACI POSTINGS: Mm.

LUCY: But to me, it was normal.

TRACI POSTINGS: Yeah, exactly.And it's like when you spoke of being little,you weren't aware of the loneliness and the emptiness.Looking back it was like, oh, that's what it was like for me.

LUCY: Yeah.And I didn't know that then.Mm.

TRACI POSTINGS: And there's somethingso, it's so awful, Lucy, about those terrible thingsbeing normal, being just how it is.

LUCY: Mm.So now I've got to try to become to be normal.

TRACI POSTINGS: So you want to be normal.

LUCY: I want to be normal.I just want to be normal and have my packed lunchand go to work, and someone to look after me, and have a dog.

TRACI POSTINGS: Who's going to make the packed lunch, now?

LUCY: Now?Um, well suppose I'll have to at the moment.

TRACI POSTINGS: Mm.

LUCY: Mm.

TRACI POSTINGS: Mm.

LUCY: So I've got to do this then, haven't I?

TRACI POSTINGS: Got to butter the bread.Choose the filling.

LUCY: Mm.

TRACI POSTINGS: Don't sound like it's what you wanted to hear.

LUCY: No, because it's still not someone taking care of me.

TRACI POSTINGS: And it doesn't feelenough to take of yourself.It's like needing an outside personto feel special to somebody.

LUCY: I don't think I'll know how to take care of myself.Yeah, well that's a bit-- that's kind of hit home a bit.

TRACI POSTINGS: It's difficult to knowhow to do something if you've never been taught or neverseen it done.

LUCY: Just go into, it just seems too much.Too much.And again, it fucking sounds so sillybecause to make a packed lunch, to butter a bit of bread,seems hard work.

TRACI POSTINGS: Yeah.And it is.Because it ain't a bit of bread.I mean it is a bit of bread, but there's so much more in it.

LUCY: This is all mad stuff.

TRACI POSTINGS: Start talking about prison and drugsand the awfulness, and we end up talking about a packed lunch.

LUCY: Yeah.Yeah.That's just mad because I feel like I could handle that life.

TRACI POSTINGS: Yeah.You know how to suffer.

LUCY: I know how to survive.

TRACI POSTINGS: You know have to survive.

LUCY: Survive, yeah.

TRACI POSTINGS: But you're just learning how to live.

LUCY: Oh, OK.Yeah, that-- that sounds nice, but actually the thought of itis, if this is life, if this is-- It's quite strange.

LUCY [continued]: The hole seems to be a little bit gone for a minute.

TRACI POSTINGS: What's filled it, Lucy?

LUCY: Don't know.You know what?It even may be someone just probably listening to me.

TRACI POSTINGS: Doesn't sound as if anybody ever asks.

LUCY: Yeah.No, I don't think they have, really.

LUCY [continued]: But hey.Well, we've got to be finished in a minute, ain't we?

TRACI POSTINGS: About five minutes.But again, we've got to wow, that's enough of that now.Thank you.

LUCY: Mm.I'm all right now.

TRACI POSTINGS: Yeah.But actually, you know, it's interesting.I think earlier on, it was like oh, don't think much of this.I'm off.But actually we are coming up to time.And considering you said I don't know how to look after myself,it's all new.There's a part of you that's saying, hold on a minute,have I got to go back into the world in a minute?

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: Back into all right, how are you doing?Yeah I'm fine.So I need to be less vulnerable than I have been in times here,which is looking after yourself.

LUCY: Oh OK.So I've done something right then.OK.

TRACI POSTINGS: So also we have got a couple of minutes,but it sounds as if you have thoughtit's about time to stop.

LUCY: Yeah, yeah.

TRACI POSTINGS: How do you feel about uscarrying on, working together, and-- How does that feel?

LUCY: I want to come.I want to come next week again.Yeah, it's mad, isn't it?

TRACI POSTINGS: It's mad?

LUCY: I like it, but I don't.

TRACI POSTINGS: Yeah.

LUCY: Yeah.But I can't explain it.I felt a little bit of warm, actually.Yeah, and I've not, yeah, actually.Since I've been here, I've not run around.

LUCY [continued]: And trying to fix that thing.Do you know what I mean?Fancying everyone I see.Eating chocolate and-- OK.

TRACI POSTINGS: Trying all sorts of waysto just find some comfort and to feel special.

LUCY: Yeah.Yeah, I can see.But now I've got to wait a week to feel that, to feel normal.All right then.All right I'll see you next week then.

TRACI POSTINGS: OK.Thanks Lucy.

LUCY: Oh, that's all right.Yeah, thanks.Thanks a lot.Should I come at the same time?

TRACI POSTINGS: Same time.

LUCY: OK.Will you be here?

TRACI POSTINGS: I'll be here.

LUCY: OK.Well then thank you.

TRACI POSTINGS: Thank you.[Counselling session with commentary,with Traci Postings, Addiction counsellor][MUSIC PLAYING]

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: Hello again, Lucy.

LUCY: Hello.

TRACI POSTINGS: How are you today?

LUCY: Mm, I don't even know.

TRACI POSTINGS: Well I know that for the first time last week,we talked about a lot of stuff.I think most of we were talking about your drug use, howdark life became then, and in a way, although life

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: is much better now that you're not using any drugs,but it's difficult and painful.And that we looked at some of the things thathave happened in your life.And talking about your mom's death.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And all the things that you went throughduring your active addition.

LUCY: And you say oh, it's better now.It is better, but I just imaginedthat I'd stop taking drugs and my life would be all right.And it ain't.It's just, it's really, really hard.

TRACI POSTINGS: And I know you said last weekthat it's really, really hard.What does that mean?What's hard?Where's hard?

LUCY: All of it, really.I think life.How am I supposed to-- it's like I don't know what to do.Kind of like I get up and I'll go through the day,it just doesn't seem easy.It's just such a-- Just stuck, I feel stuck a lot of time.

LUCY [continued]: It's like turmoil.

TRACI POSTINGS: Under turmoil.Something that you spoke about last week,it's something that seems to be with you a lot of the time.And you also said last week about not being up to settle,not been easy.

LUCY: It's like that all the time.It's just that, it's like I've justgot to do things, all the time.Just got to do, do, do, do, do.And I try and go home and just sit down,and I have to clean up, and the I can't even watch telly.And then I've to speak to someone.It's just like when is it just going to stop?

LUCY [continued]: Do you know what I mean?This is how I feel.It's like when is it going to be all right?

TRACI POSTINGS: When is it going to be all right?Or when are you going to be all right?Which one are we talking about?

LUCY: I don't know, really.Will I ever be all right?I don't know.

TRACI POSTINGS: There was somethingabout that that seemed quite tricky to hear, as I said,when will it be all right or when will you be all right?You really-- I don't know.How did that feel when I said that?Because you seemed to really, like, hold up.

LUCY: Yeah, I thought, that kind of threw me.Is it it?Is it me?Is it?

TRACI POSTINGS: What is it?

LUCY: What is it?Yeah.

TRACI POSTINGS: What is it?

LUCY: Yeah, I don't even know what it is.

TRACI POSTINGS: But we keep saying "it" as if it's a thing.

LUCY: It just hurts.It fucking hurts.

TRACI POSTINGS: In the first few minutes of the session,Lucy begins by talking about how difficult she's finding lifenow that she's not using drugs and alcohol.This is a real surprise to her, because she reallybelieved that her problem was drugs and alcohol,and that if she were no longer using these, life would be OK.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And she's having to face now that life is difficult,and that reality can sometimes be relentless.She talks about a disease, and for me, this

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: personifies the disease of addiction, the restlessnessand the discontent that she refers to.And she talks about "it."And that the way she talks makes itdifficult to know whether she's referring

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: to something outside of herself or inside of herself.And she's really not sure, just that "it" is horribleand, as she says at the end, "it" is really painful.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And my understanding, at this time, is the "it"she's speaking about is actually the fragmented,really frightened, and really hurtlittle girl that she once was.And the part of her that carries all the trauma and all

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: the horrendous things that have happened to her over the years.And that "it" is indeed very painful and very, verydifficult for her to contain.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And if I think of addiction in different terms, whatI was thinking at that time is that although the lifestyle sheled while using drugs, and the lifestylewas awful, in some ways the drugswere like putting the hand or a handover the mouth of a three-year-old.And so Lucy couldn't hear the horrendous cries

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: of who she once was.And now that hand is in many ways removedand the drugs are gone.That part of herself is very loud, in some ways.And for me it was very important, at this point,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: to be sure that, or to be as sureas I could be they Lucy was able to engagein the work we would do.Because the risk is, of course, isif her distress were too great, that she would chooseto soothe herself with drugs.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And it would be an unconscious choice.I'm not saying that she would go out and choose to use drugs,because most of what happens is, of course, unconscious.But that our work had to be safe and that get togetherwe could contain this part of her.And that outside of the session she

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: would be able to have adequate supportand be robust enough herself to beable to hold this part of her.And I think I didn't say this at this pointbecause I waited to see how the session we unfold,and also how Lucy felt and thought

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: about what her experience was being drug free.And it's something in you that hurts.

LUCY: Maybe.[SIGH] I just wish it was all different, really.

LUCY [continued]: You know, I sometimes think like, if my mom neverdied, would I have took drugs.Would I have ended up taking heroine?I don't know.Whenever my brothers introduced me to it,would I have ever took it?If my upbringing was different, would I be different?

LUCY [continued]: And I kind of rough it, but it justseems to be kind of no different.At different-- no, I'm not in prison,and I'm not committing crime, and, it's

LUCY [continued]: like I don't know what I was expecting,but I just want to be all right.

TRACI POSTINGS: And actually, it sounds as if a part of youis still in prison, because you said, you know, I'm not,I'm not in prison, but this, this.When's it going to be all right?When's going to-- when's it?What is it?And was it this and a searching and atrying to work it all out.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And understanding that life's much better,but actually, to be honest, it doesn't sound as if it'smuch better for a part of you.That the practicalities might be better, but part of youis still locked away in prison.

LUCY: But so I'm npt-- how am I supposedto understand all that?It's like, is that what I don't know.Is that why I've come here?

LUCY [continued]: I just don't really understand it all, really.

TRACI POSTINGS: So why do you think you came here?

LUCY: To get some understanding of it.So I can get there, wherever I'm going.It's just endless.I just sometimes think if my mom was still here,

LUCY [continued]: would that make me feel better?If I had a job, would it be better?If I had a boyfriend, would it be better?It's like anything, grabbing onto anything, really, justto make me feel better, really.

TRACI POSTINGS: Just something outside the youcan take inside and find some peace.

LUCY: Yeah.I just feel it.I could just feel that.It's like a hole.

TRACI POSTINGS: And nothing's filling it.

LUCY: Even food.I just, I can eat and eat and eat and eat and eat.And then I just feel sick.And then like I think you fat bitch.

TRACI POSTINGS: So then there's this need to keep eating,to keep doing something, to get something.But then you really give yourself a hard time.It's just there's a need inside you.

LUCY: Yeah.It just doesn't fill up.

TRACI POSTINGS: It's a hole in your pocket, Lucy.

LUCY: There's a hole in my pocket.

TRACI POSTINGS: You've mentioned your mom a couple of times.

LUCY: I don't know.I just think, would be really nice.Do you know what?I think I get jealous of other people,and they're growing up and going to be moms.And I'll go like, oh.And it really kind of-- so now that I've grown up,

LUCY [continued]: I'd like to have a relationship with her,but it's almost, again, I'm never going to have that.Do you know what I mean?It's just not going to happen.And even if she was still alive, she'd most probablytell me to go away, anyway.

TRACI POSTINGS: That seems at oddsthat you're desperate, to have this person,to have something to make it OK.And you want your mom.

LUCY: Mm-hmm.

TRACI POSTINGS: And yet, there's also the,and it didn't sound like a fear, it sounded more like amaybe that she'd tell you to go away.

LUCY: She was quite harsh.And I, I just wanted her to be nice to me, really.

TRACI POSTINGS: You wanted a mom.

LUCY: Yeah.

TRACI POSTINGS: You wanted one then, and you need one now.

LUCY: It's just that feeling of, am I going to be all right.You know?Maybe I just want someone to say it's going to be all right.

TRACI POSTINGS: Comfort.

LUCY: [SIGH] So what do I do?Do you know what I mean?What am I supposed to do if-- did

LUCY [continued]: you know that when I took gear, I didn't get this,I didn't get all this.And I just wasn't expecting that.I just keep getting overwhelmed and I justget really, really sad and--

TRACI POSTINGS: It sounds like there's just nothing that can,there's nothing that you can findthat can look after a little girl who wants her mom.And it's just too much for you to try and manage.But it sounds like the gear did it, in a weird sort of way,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: that it was your mom for a while.

LUCY: Yeah.It kind of helped me.It's something that we say that allowed me for a little while.

TRACI POSTINGS: Yeah.That allowed you to look at something else.

LUCY: Yeah.

TRACI POSTINGS: And maybe that's what you are looking for now.You're looking for someone to hold you.

LUCY: Yeah, that makes sense.It's quite scary, really, because, this

LUCY [continued]: is how it's kind of going to be, constantly just trying to makemyself feel all right, really.

TRACI POSTINGS: And also, it's blooming horriblebecause the fantasy was, and the promise was, you stop usingand it'll be OK.And instead, everything that held you together, in a sense,it feels as if it's gone.And what's so horrible is what was holding you together

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: was killing you as well.

LUCY: I don't know where I've gone, I just don't.

TRACI POSTINGS: Said, I don't know where I've gone.

LUCY: How long have we got left?

TRACI POSTINGS: We've got a little while.Feels as if some part of you has had enough.

LUCY: Yeah.

TRACI POSTINGS: It's like right, that's it.

LUCY: Yeah.

TRACI POSTINGS: I'll be off now.As the session continues, I like to thinkwe've begun to build on our relationship.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And this helped us to explore further what "it" is.And this opened up to an emptinessshe feels inside, a hole, that absolutely nothing she doescan fill it.And that she's looking outside of herself, with food,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: perhaps trying to get a boyfriend, trying to work,or thinking if I had this, if I had this, if I had this,then it would fill it.But no matter what she pours into herself,it's never enough.Again, this highlights a saying in addiction

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: that one is too many and 1,000 never enough.But she just cannot fill this almost bottomless pit insideher.And I think our, as a human, we shared,when I said about there's a hole in your pocket, Lucy, actually

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: enhanced our relationship.And I felt that we drew a little bit closer at that point.But actually Lucy is facing tryingto live a life in which she has absolutely none of the toolsand none of the equipment that a good enough upbringing would

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: have afforded her to negotiate life.When she spoke about her mother, initially,it was with a great yearning.But then actually when she began to look at the reality of that,her mother was really harsh.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And that gives us a little viewing to a very lonelychildhood, is how I thought of it, that her mother wouldhave told her to go away.And that what she was looking for was a mother.And, interestingly, she spoke about the drugs holding her.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And that now she's looking for being held,and some of the ways she can't find it.And again, one of the definitions of addictionthat I spoke about earlier is that addiction is simplya very, very desperate lack of love.And as Lucy talks about her experience,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: we can see that not only was there this enormous absenceof love in her childhood, and also in her active addiction,but also that she's not able to give that love to herself.When she talks about eating and eating and eating,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: trying to soothe that needy, needyfrightened child that's inside her,that she calls herself a fat bitch, because she's hurting.And so the lack of love is not only outside of her,but inside of her as well.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And in some ways, you know she's looking for something to holdthis part of her, and it's almost,the picture I had was of someone having a colicky baby,say, look, you take this baby, for goodness sake,will you look at, please somebody take this babyfrom me.And the drugs held the baby for a while, possibly

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: the relationships she had held the baby for a while,the food when she binges holds the baby for a while.But actually, the baby is hers to hold,and I think at this point, not only doesn't she know that yet,but also perhaps it's a very enormous undertaking for her.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: As we began to explore this part of her,there was a point when she said, how much longer have we got?And I think that actually, for me,that really fostered my hope that there that was

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: a part of Lucy that looked out for her.Because she was saying very clearly, hold on,I had enough now.That's enough.And I guess we were exploring the housethat I spoke about earlier, together,to look at what damage had been doneand what we needed to do to heal certain parts of her.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And she was saying, you know, that's enough.I've seen enough now.I want to step back a bit.And so that's-- and it's actually,once I reflected on the session, it's something that I wish Ihad, not at that time, perhaps, but that a bit later,I'd have been able to communicate to her,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: to let her know that actually there is a robust part of her,but there is a part of her that can take care of herself.

LUCY: Yeah, so, yeah.

TRACI POSTINGS: So it's a different part of you, now.Is that right?Thank you.

LUCY: Yeah.I don't know.Just, the sickness, it's almost like closed now.

TRACI POSTINGS: Mm.So, a little part could be seen, now that shifts.And I'm mindful that you said youcame here looking for answers, looking to sort it.And maybe it shifts against me who'snot giving you those answers.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: I'm not telling you what the solution is.

LUCY: But will you be able to do that, though?If I can't find it?Where do I look?Again, I thought, oh well that just shows me,

LUCY [continued]: everywhere I go, expecting.I expected it from my mom.She never gave me anything.

TRACI POSTINGS: And I was just thinking exactly that.That you come here with an expectation--

LUCY: Yeah.

TRACI POSTINGS: --and I just join a long lineof people that let you down.And I don't come up with the goods.

LUCY: So what do you do, then?Why am I?What is supposed to happen?Because it just sounds that it's justgoing to be another waste of time,just like everything else is, really.

LUCY [continued]: Oh, fucking how this is just--

TRACI POSTINGS: Sounds like it's pissing you off.

LUCY: Yeah.

TRACI POSTINGS: And yet, when I saidit sounds like it's pissing you off,I think what I meant was maybe I'm pissing you off.But, you said yeah.But, as you said yeah, it soundedlike you weren't pissed off anymore, if that makes sense.And you sort of, well, maybe it's difficult to be.Don't know.Find out what things.

LUCY: Yeah, I thought, I don't know if-- I don't know really.I don't know if I'm pissed off with you.I don't even know you enough to be pissed off with you, really.I'm just pissed off of it all really.

LUCY [continued]: With myself, with life, with-- I just can't get out of that one.I wished it was different.I just wished it was different.

TRACI POSTINGS: How would you have it, Lucy?How would it be?

LUCY: I would have like to have been special.That's what I would've liked.To have been shown some love and attention.I think more of attention.And I remember being at school, and, you know,

LUCY [continued]: like the moms used to come and take their kids,drop their kids off.And I used to have to go to school on my own.And just that sort of envy, like,oh I wish my mom done that.You know, pack lunch and pack you money

LUCY [continued]: and be able to buy sweets in the morning and-- even my momsaying goodnight, really.So, do you know what?I just think this is, like, even thought she died,

LUCY [continued]: it's almost a dream-- like, I wanted it to be like that,but actually it won't.So it's hard to get out.You know, people say to me, oh, was you close to your mom?And I go yeah, but I wasn't.

TRACI POSTINGS: But you wanted to be.

LUCY: Yeah.And that's, it's almost like, because I knowI'm never going to have it.I could make it up if I want it to happen.

TRACI POSTINGS: Yeah.

LUCY: And that is the reality, like I said.If I went to her now, she'd emotionally take off anyway.So I kind of know that, but can't get outof that fantasy just to pretend it's all OK,do you know what I mean?

TRACI POSTINGS: And that you are special to her,and you are loved.

LUCY: Yeah.

TRACI POSTINGS: And somebody comes to schooland makes you a packed lunch and says night-night, tucks you up.And loves you.And loves you in a way so that you feel loved.

LUCY: Yeah.Just felt lonely as a kid, just by myself generally.She was actually quite frightening.

TRACI POSTINGS: So you were lonely and scared.

LUCY: Yeah.I think that's how I feel a lot of the time, actually.And again, I'll kind of-- I still pretend it's all right.

LUCY [continued]: And I know, you're fine.You're fine.

TRACI POSTINGS: It's all OK.

LUCY: Yeah.But I still got that feeling there.

TRACI POSTINGS: So you've traveled a heel of a journey,and you've arrived at the lonely and scared loveless place.

LUCY: Yeah, this is what's [INAUDIBLE] enough.It's happened.I've been to prison loads of times.And I'm tough.I'm a tough cookie.And that's what's almost thrown me, actually.We've got these recoveries-- this is what's--

TRACI POSTINGS: Not what you were expecting.

LUCY: No, I didn't know about-- youknow what, that's quite weird, actually,because I could've said I didn't know what it waslike to be lonely or scared.But I just said that as a child I was like that.

LUCY [continued]: But I didn't know I'd felt like that.So if this is what's supposed to happen, you give up the drugsand that comes.

TRACI POSTINGS: Well, this is what has happened.And it's almost-- what I'm, want I'vebeen thinking the last few minutes is if you have everheard the story of the little match girl.Have you heard that story?

LUCY: Vaguely.

TRACI POSTINGS: She's very poor and raggedy.And briefly she sells matches to try and get a few pennies.And the people that look after her don't look after her.They're very cruel and she's not treated well.And one winter it's so cold, that even though she'sgoing to get in trouble, she lights a match, just

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: for a little bit of warmth.Just for a little bit of warmth.Just a little bit.But when she lights the match and the flame,she sees what she remembers as her grandmother's house.And in the flame, she sees her loving grandmother,and a table with food, and she sees a warm fire.Everything she's ever wanted.And then the match goes out.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And she's too frightened then to light another one,but the next night, when she's in the snow and the cold,she lights a match.And she sees again everything she ever wanted in that flame.And it goes out.But this time she lights another, and another,and another, until they're all gone.And it just reminded me, as you're

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: talking about gear and drug use, for that time, you didn't feel,you didn't know about the fear, and the aloneness,and the terror, and misery.Because the promise was in the flame.But that's gone.The matches are all burnt out.

LUCY: And this is it, now then?

TRACI POSTINGS: However, I'm alsovery mindful of a few minutes ago, you said, but I'm tough.What's this?What's this?I'm tough.And you see, I believe the little girl, absolutely.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: But I also believe the tough part,or you wouldn't be sitting here.

LUCY: But I don't know if I can handle this part.This is--

TRACI POSTINGS: It's too heavy, too much.

LUCY: It's kind of like it's quite easy to be tough.I kind of like her.The toughness is wearing out, really.

TRACI POSTINGS: Yeah, yeah.And there's nowhere to hide.There's no drugs.There's no matches.There's no matches.

LUCY: Yeah.

TRACI POSTINGS: And the pain is so deep, and the wound soraw at the minute.It's like, oh my god, what am I going to do with this?

LUCY: Yeah.

TRACI POSTINGS: As the session unfolds,Lucy really begins to get in touchwith the really frightened, lonely part of herself.And she begins to almost separate fantasy from reality.She yearns very desperately to be special

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: and to have someone care for her.And she puts her mother in that role,as someone two would care for her,and you know, someone she had a really great relationship with.But actually she knows that that's not true.And as the session unfolds, more and more

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: of the reality of her relationship with her motheris opened in that her mother would probablytell her to go away if she did approach her.And then her mother was quite harsh.And then finally she was quite scary, actually.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And Lucy, for the first time, acknowledges that as a child,she was very frightened and very lonely.But that even as a child, she hadn't acknowledged this.That she locked that part of herself away somewhereand the image I got was again of Lucy's house.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And that we're now beginning to look in the rooms thathave been very badly damaged and that hadbeen locked up for a long time.And we just beginning to open the doorand finding out whether the floor is safe enoughto stand on, and to be able to go in.And once we're in, we can begin.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: We can begin the journey of healing.And it was during this period and justbefore, when Lucy began talking about her mother,that I felt really moved by what she was talking about.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And I believe this was for two reasons.Initially, I believe that the, you know,I was really with Lucy at this time.But in the face of such unbearable suffering,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: and the awful experiences she went through,but on a very human level, I found that very moving.But also on a personal level, in that Lucy's feelingsand Lucy's experience touched on that part of me,the wounded part of myself.But although our experiences weren't exactly the same,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: I believe I know that place within myself.And I believe that that, during that part of the session,we became closer.And perhaps Lucy felt able to be pissed off with me, a little.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: Only a little.But she became a little frustrated at,you know, what am I here for?What do you do?What's the point of this?Have you got the answers?Who's got the answers?And actually, what we were doing was justbuilding our relationship and getting to know each other,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: building a rapport.And that felt to be the most important thing.And I felt that when I told the story of the little match girl,that actually I was talking to a very little girl.And it reminded me of almost of a mother

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: telling a bedtime story to a child.And but that actually it's a very sad storybecause all the special loveliness that Lucy wantedwas in the lie of the flame.And that each time it went out, her hopes were dashed.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And it was during this phase of the sessionthat there was a hopelessness, and a real fear in Lucyof like oh my god, if this is howit is then, so if this is how it is, what am I going to do?This is just, I can't bear this.How am I going to live like this?And I believe that at that time I held the hope

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: and was able then to bring into the sessionthat, yes, this part of her is deeply hurt.But there is another part, it's the part that survived outon the streets, that it's a tough part.And that although this tough part it's now tempered in a way

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: by this very wounded, frightened child part,that that part still exists.And towards the end of that clip,it felt very important that when Lucysaid what am I going to do, that I responded by what are we

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: going to do about this?And I would hope in some way thatwas the beginnings of a relationship that could heal,rather than the false hope that I would've given herif I'd have been telling her what she could do,and what she should do, and what this was, and what that was,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: and trying to be ever so helpful.That may have looked as if I was offering help,but it would've been a false help and a false hope.And the only person that would've felt any better for itwould've been myself.And so I felt that just being able to stay with Lucy,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: and for her to be able to be pissed off with me,and for her to be able to be frustratedwith the whole process, was more beneficial for our relationshipand for our work.

LUCY: So what do I do then?

TRACI POSTINGS: Well what are we going to do about this?

LUCY: Well you tell me, because you're the therapist.

TRACI POSTINGS: What does she need?

LUCY: I don't know.I need a match.

TRACI POSTINGS: Mm-hmm.And the match always worked, the bitter gear always worked.But actually, every single time, without fail,it abandoned you just like everybody else did.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And I'm sitting wondering if the trick is to find one of them,you have a light and matches.

LUCY: Yeah, that would be good.Wouldn't it?Yeah, just, like, will it ever-- you know,what you see in the match, I can see what you're saying.Will I ever get to that-- is life-- well, I can only say,

LUCY [continued]: it's like, if I light, will that match become real?Do you know what I mean?Or is it just going to be wishing, wishing, wishing?

TRACI POSTINGS: And more fantasy, and more pretend,and more illusion.

LUCY: Because that's what [INAUDIBLE].Now it's, I'm going to, when I leave here in a minute,I'm going just go like, oh, hello, yeah, I'm fine.

TRACI POSTINGS: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

LUCY: And pretend.

TRACI POSTINGS: Yeah.

LUCY: I just do whatever I can, to get through the day.

TRACI POSTINGS: I'm wondering, you know,that part, the survivor, you that goes about and says hello,are you all right?What are you doing?Yeah, and has a laugh, and you know, the tough bit.Did that part of you bring the other part here?To be able to be with just the awful emptiness.

LUCY: I don't know.I just came.

TRACI POSTINGS: Mm-hmm.Looking for answers.

LUCY: Yeah.

TRACI POSTINGS: That you're not getting.

LUCY: Yeah.All right, so, how many times have I got to see you?Another five times?

TRACI POSTINGS: And it's like we've gone back into your head,OK, I need a chart now.Do six of these and three of them, four of themand it will be all right.

LUCY: Yeah, will it be all right?

TRACI POSTINGS: And it feels very different in herethen when we were talking about the feelings,when we were talking about, when we were talking about the hurt.We had become quite businesslike.

LUCY: All right.Yeah but still.I still--

TRACI POSTINGS: How much longer?

LUCY: Yeah.So can you not tell me nothing?Can you not?You ain't got the answers if I got the answers.

LUCY [continued]: It just seems all too hard again.

TRACI POSTINGS: Yeah.It feels really heavy at the minute, and, what do we do?And yet, what really, and I was goingto say, what really strikes me-- whichis really interesting after talking about matches-- as you

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: said what you were looking, I'm looking for a match,actually, since we've been talking,although life is harder-- practically it's much better,but you're in so much more discomfort and diseasesince you've stopped taking drugs, I haven't heard you say,I want to go and use something.I want to go and use drugs.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: Heard you say you want your mom.But I haven't heard you say, I've had enough of this.I'm--

LUCY: I can't.I can't.I used for so long.I've tried to stop so many times.I'm sick of smoking crack, being raped, and sick of prison.

LUCY [continued]: And I've tried to stop loads of times, but what happened wasI got sick off the drugs.And when I used to score, it used to be in my hand.And there's like a famous walk.Like you got the walk on, because,

LUCY [continued]: you know, from the smoke.And I lost it.So I just, I don't feel like smoking drugs,but I just want to feel all right.

TRACI POSTINGS: Yeah, you've had enough of that.

LUCY: It didn't, it stopped working.It stopped doing what it said on the tin for me.

TRACI POSTINGS: Yeah.And so there's an ending there.And here we are, and OK, that don't work.But you're in a place-- that don'twork-- we're not there yet.And this middle place of well, what will work?What do I have to do?

LUCY: OK.OK.

TRACI POSTINGS: It's between a rock and a hard place, really.It's really difficult.

LUCY: Yeah.But you know what?That's kind of made me feel good a bit,because I didn't think that I wasn't [INAUDIBLE] and thinkingof using.So I'm not thinking of using.And that's got be a good thing, isn't it?

TRACI POSTINGS: You're looking for comfort.And you're looking for ease.And do I get a job?I want normal.You're looking for something.

LUCY: So have I got to get that, though?

TRACI POSTINGS: What did you say?You wanted to feel special.

LUCY: Yeah.

TRACI POSTINGS: You wanted to feel special.And you wanted to feel cared for.You wanted to have somebody make you a packed lunch.

LUCY: Yeah.Sounds quite silly.

TRACI POSTINGS: Silly?

LUCY: I want someone to make me a packed lunch.

TRACI POSTINGS: Get to go to school all nice and clean,and nice uniform, nice clothes, your packed lunchin a little box, wrapped up nice.Instead of the picture I got, of the little girl you said, justwent any old how, with nobody to saygoodbye, nobody to make breakfast.

LUCY: Yeah.Do you know what?This is what I get, because that ain't going to happen anymore.That's passed.So this is where I get angry, because it's like Iwant all that, but it's gone.

LUCY [continued]: It's gone.Do you know what I mean?And then that's-- Because I suppose, all right,that's where I'll go with my mom, I want it.I wanted it.But then I'll get, well you never bloody gave it to me.

TRACI POSTINGS: And it's too late now.

LUCY: Well it's too late now.What if?What if?What if?What if?

TRACI POSTINGS: If only.Maybe.

LUCY: And that's kind of what goes on,do you know what I mean?Again, looking back at the girls at school, I wonder if they,I wonder how their life is.Do you know what I mean?If they became normal.You know what I mean?

TRACI POSTINGS: Or if they walked through hell like youhave.

LUCY: And it's really strange, whatyou're saying, because it's like,the lives, if I told someone about my life, the crackhouses, being raped, being beaten up,fighting, going to prison.

LUCY [continued]: Saying it like that sounds quite awful.But to me it was normal.

TRACI POSTINGS: Yeah, exactly.And it's like when you spoke of being little,you weren't aware of the loneliness and the emptiness.Looking back, it was like oh, that's what it was like for me.

LUCY: Yeah.And I didn't know that then.Mm.

TRACI POSTINGS: And there's somethingso, it's so awful, Lucy, about those terrible thingsbeing normal, being just how it is.

LUCY: Mm.

TRACI POSTINGS: As we moved into the latter stagesof the session, I was very mindfulthat Lucy spoke about some really awful things,about being raped, about fighting,about the crack houses, about going to prison.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And she'd mentioned these earlier in the session.And there was a part of me thinking,I wonder if she's wanting me to pick up on one of these.But, actually, I think this was just--I do think it was more important for us to stay on buildingour relationship and for me to get

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: to know this wounded and frightened part of her.And for her to be able to give that part of herself a voice.And that felt the foundations for our work.And I certainly would guess that if Lucy wantedto bring these other events to future sessions,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: then of course they'd be things we could, we would work on.But what was really startling, actually,was how normal these events were in her life.When just one of these events for some peoplewould be incredibly, it would be a life-changing, horrendous

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: atrocity, actually.But for Lucy, it was a way of life.She didn't talk about this terrible thing happened,she was raped.She spoke about the rapes, the fights, the prison sentences,the crack houses.So these weren't singular events.This was a lifestyle.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And I think it's very important for me to acknowledge,although this was normal for Lucy,and this was her experience, that that does nottake away from the horrendous impact ithad on her as a person.Because I think it would be easy to me

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: to fall into the trap of thinking,oh yes, this was just her way of life.When actually, all of these thingsstandalone as terrible things to happen to a human being.And I think it's important for me to remember this.And as we just moved into that part of the session,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: I did make an intervention where I asked Lucyif, I wondered whether the very street-wise tough part of herbrought the wounded child to counseling to be healed.Now although I actually, I actually

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: still stand by that statement, I don'tbelieve it was the correct thing to say in the session.I believe it was a bit jargony, and that itwould've made no sense to Lucy.So it made sense to me, but it didn't make any sense to Lucy,so therefore it didn't really, it wasn't really helpful.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: Although, I do like to think that on an unconscious level,she heard what I was saying.But she very beautifully said, I don't know.I just came.So, which is lovely.As we moved to the latter part of the session,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: Lucy was, I felt, beginning to realize, actually,that the answer was with her.That there was no one going to come along and make it better.No one was going to come along and tuck her up in bed.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: No one was going to come along and putwhat had happened right.And it was done, and it was gone.And actually, there was the beginnings of her realization,though it may not be fair, but, this is her legacy,in some ways, the legacy of her past,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: and the work she needs to do in order to recover and livea life with some joy.I actually found it quite interestingwhen Lucy spoke about that, in a sense,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: the drugs stopped working.And this came after I'd-- I've noticed, actually,that although she was in tremendous pain and reallystruggling to cope in her day-to-day life,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: she hadn't mentioned wanting to use drugs or go back to her oldlifestyle.That hadn't been mentioned at all.And although she said that the drugs had stopped working,and I think to a certain extent that's true,I think they had stopped being able to soothe her,they had stopped being able to placate her,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: to calm the disease, I also like to think of it a different way,in that perhaps the screams of that wounded childwere so loud now that they needed to be heardand didn't need to be covered up anymore.And that there was a deeper part of herself

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: that realized that Lucy was at a placewhere she could access the support, the information,and the caring she needed in orderto do the work she needed in order to heal.

LUCY: So now I've got to try to become to be normal.

TRACI POSTINGS: So, you want to be normal.

LUCY: I want to be normal.I just want to be normal and have my packed lunchand go to work, and someone to look after me, and have a dog.

TRACI POSTINGS: Who's going to make the packed lunch now?

LUCY: Now?Um, well I suppose I'll have to at the moment.

TRACI POSTINGS: Mm.

LUCY: Mm.

TRACI POSTINGS: Mm.

LUCY: So I've got to do this then, haven't I?

TRACI POSTINGS: Got to butter the bread.Choose the filling.

LUCY: Mm.

TRACI POSTINGS: Don't sound like it's what you wanted to hear.

LUCY: Because it's still not someone taking care of me.

TRACI POSTINGS: And it doesn't feelenough to take care of yourself.It's like needing an outside person,to feel special to somebody.

LUCY: I don't think I'll know how to take care of myself.Yeah, well, that's a bit, that's kind of hit home a bit.

TRACI POSTINGS: It's difficult to knowhow to do something if you've never been taught, or neverseen it done.

LUCY: Just go into, it just seems too much.Too much.And again, it fucking sounds so silly,because to make a packed lunch, to butter a bit of bread,it seems hard work.

TRACI POSTINGS: Yeah.And it is, because it ain't a bit of bread.It is a bit of bread, but there's so much more in it.

LUCY: This is all mad stuff.

TRACI POSTINGS: Start talking about prison and drugsand the awfulness and we end up talking about a packed lunch.

LUCY: Yeah.Yeah.That's just mad, because I feel like I could handle that life.

TRACI POSTINGS: Yeah.You know how to suffer.

LUCY: I know how to survive.

TRACI POSTINGS: You know how to survive.But you're just learning how to live.

LUCY: Oh, OK.Mm.Yeah, that-- That sounds nice, but actually the thought of itis, if this is life, if this is-- It's quite strange.

LUCY [continued]: The hole seems to be a little bit gone, for a minute.

TRACI POSTINGS: What's filled it, Lucy?

LUCY: Don't know.You know what?It even may be someone just probably listening to me.

TRACI POSTINGS: Doesn't sound as if anybody ever asks.

LUCY: Yeah.No, I don't think they have, really.

LUCY [continued]: But hey.Well we've got to be finished in a minute, ain't we?

TRACI POSTINGS: About five minutes.But again, we've got to wow, that's enough of that now.Thank you.

LUCY: Mm.I'm all right now.

TRACI POSTINGS: But actually, you know, it's interesting.I think earlier on, it was like oh, don't think much of this,I'm off.But actually, we are coming up to time.And considering you said I don't know how to look after myself,it's all new.There's a part of you that's saying, hold on a minute.Have I got to go back into the world in a minute?Back into all right, how are you doing?

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: Yeah, I'm fine.So I need to be less vulnerable than I have been in times here,which is looking after yourself.

LUCY: Oh, OK.So I've done something right, then.OK.

TRACI POSTINGS: So also we have got a couple of minutes,but it sounds as if you have thoughtthat's about time to stop.

LUCY: Yeah.Yeah.

TRACI POSTINGS: How do you feel about uscarrying on, working together?How does that feel?

LUCY: I want to come.I want to come next week again.It's mad, isn't it?

TRACI POSTINGS: It's mad?

LUCY: I like it, but I don't.

TRACI POSTINGS: Yeah.

LUCY: Yeah.But I can't explain it.I felt a little bit of warmth, actually.Yeah, and I've not, yeah, actually.Since I've been here, I've not run around.

LUCY [continued]: And trying to fix that thing.Do you know what I mean?Fancying everyone I see.Eating chocolate and-- OK.

TRACI POSTINGS: Trying all sorts of waysto just find some comfort and to feel special.

LUCY: Yeah.Yeah, I can see.But now I've got to wait a week to feel that, to feel normal.All right then.All right, I'll see you next week then.

TRACI POSTINGS: OK.Thanks Lucy.

LUCY: Oh, that's all right.Thanks.Thanks a lot.Shall I come at the same time?

TRACI POSTINGS: Same time.

LUCY: OK.Will you be here?

TRACI POSTINGS: I'll be here.

LUCY: OK.All right then, thank you.

TRACI POSTINGS: Thank you.There were some quite important thingsthat happened as we came up to the end of the session.We'd spoken about earlier in the session,when Lucy went to school and her friends had a packed lunch,and that she didn't.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And that how much she wants to be normal,to have a dog, and a job, and a packed lunch.And as we looked at that, Lucy cameto realize that there was nobody whowas going to make the packed lunch for her,and that she had to, she would have

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: to, if you wanted a packed lunch, make it for herself.And it almost felt to me that during that part,we were just planting, very gently plantingsome seeds of self care.And this is something very frightening for Lucy.As she said, she preferred going to prison

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: than having to make a packed lunch for herself.Because, actually, we weren't talking about a packed lunch.We were talking about her taking responsibility for herselfand for her life, and for her own well being.And that is a monumental undertakingfor someone who has never, who's just not

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: equipped to do this, as yet.And I think that that was quite difficult for Lucy.And a reality and a truth that she really didn't wantto accept.But within that, there was also a realization

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: of the role, or of the place our relationship couldhave in her life, which would perhapssignify that other such relationships wouldbe possible in future times.And what she said was that the hole is a little bit filled,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: which would suggest, it would suggest actually in some waysthat I took on the role of the match,or even the role of heroine, but actually Iwould hope in a more functional, loving way.But what I would hope that my role did

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: was to be able to be with that frightened, woundedlittle girl.And what Lucy was able to say after that was perhapsit was simply being listened to.And what, although I had listenedto the tough part of her, and the strong part, the survivorpart, I'd also heard the voice of a child that

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: had never been able to verbalize experience before.And I think that was what perhaps helpedher feel soothed a little.And as we moved closer to the end of the session,and talked about our continuing work,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: Lucy said that she liked it, but that she didn't like it.And that, to me, was saying although it's painful,walking, walking through this abandoned old house, that'sbeen falling apart around my ears, well though it's painful,it's also nice to be heard.And it's also, maybe she felt special,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: just by simply having some attention.And some warm affection.And as we walk together through the house,perhaps there's hope that one day it would be a home.And I also felt that we did end the session about five minutes

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: early, but it felt very important to meto let Lucy have control of that ending,because she's had so little control of anythingelse in her life.And that, for me to put faith in her abilityto care for herself, and to know that, hang on a minute,I've got to go out in the street,I need to get back into my survivor self

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: and be ready to face the world.I felt it was very poignant to the last comment that Lucymade, after we'd ended and checked times and sessionsand went to the nuts and bolts, where she asked me,if I'd be there the next week.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And I was able to answer, yes, I will be here.But what I heard was a very tiny little girllooking for reassurance and looking for the hopethat someone could be there for her,and not abandon her as all of the people thatwere meant to care have.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: [Summary]From the work so far with Lucy, Ibelieve that we have formed a relationship.And I certainly felt very close to Lucyat times during that session and during our initial session.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And I believe we have a good foundationto build on and develop our relationship.I see much of our work is hearing, much of our worktogether is me being able to hear,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: and us together being able to bear the pain, the woundedness,and the hurts that Lucy has suffered throughout her life.I think it's important that together, we'reable to in some ways bear witness to her experience.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And also, that Lucy has another person,in that alone and empty place.I think as Lucy's journey into recovery continues,there are many things she will possiblywant to look at and want to heal,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: but I think it's important for us to keep it in the dayand in the moment, and just focus on us being together,and for me being able to understand, to understand Lucy,but most importantly, to be able to hear, to hear her truth.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And for me, that is the essence of our work together.[The importance of the client-counsellor relationship]I do believe that the relationship that Lucyand I formed during that session and during our initial sessionis vitally important for our future work.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And I do feel that Lucy felt understood by meand listened to, which was also very important.And I don't see our relationship as a treatment approach.I don't see that I will be doing anything,informing Lucy of anything.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: I feel that we're going to be working together.And we're going to be working together so that Lucy can finda way that those two parts of herself we've identified,that can come closer together.And that she will be able to make

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: a packed lunch for herself.And I think that Lucy did come to the session--although I don't think she realized it-- shecame to the session with hope.And she also came to the session with a motivation to change.She was very clear that she was unhappy with the way

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: things were.And that the very fact that she came to counselingsignifies that she hoped that this were possible.And it felt that during the session, she lost this hopeand she lost the motivation, and it was at that pointthat I needed to hold the hope.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And it was at that point that I neededto believe that she was capable of changing and livinga fulfilling life.And it reminded me of a really old sayingI heard years and years ago.And it was about an old sociology experiment,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: and what it said was what the teacher believes,the student achieves.And when I work, I like to translate thatto what the counselor believes, the client achieves.And if I sit believing that Lucy's situation is hopeless,and she might as well give up after having sucha horrendous past, then I will be communicating

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: that, even if I don't do it in my words,that will be communicated in our relationship, when actually Idon't believe that.And I do believe that change is possibleand that Lucy can have a fulfilling life.And for her as well, that really desperate, wounded part,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: I need to be-- and I remember reading a book by Symingtonat some point about being able to bearthe screams of a terrified, frantic child.I need to be able to do that.And I need to be able to bear the terrified screams of my ownfragmented part, because if not, I won't be able to bear

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: listening to anyone else's.And if that were the case, it would be at that pointI would be pulling back away from Lucy,and perhaps offering advice and suggestions about what sheshould do, changing the subject, or stopping listening, whichis why I think it's been incredibly important for meto have been on my own journey of healing and of recovery,

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: and to be able to be with that part of myselfin order to allow me to be present with that fragmentedpart of Lucy.So, I do see Lucy's recovery as a journey.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And I hope we can walk a good part of it together.And that Lucy has a lot of healing to do,but she actually also brings a robustness to the work.This street part of her, I absolutelybelieve will see her through.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And the fact that she was able to bewith both parts of herself in the sessionis quite phenomenal.And she did that without any drugs, without any alcohol,with no chocolate, with, there was certainlyno boyfriend in the room.So together, we were able to hold that part of her.

TRACI POSTINGS [continued]: And if we can do that, that is proofto her and to her internal will that it's possible.